Exclusive Q&A With Wes Hein (Enigma Records)

Posted April 17, 2009

Daryn Hinton & Wes Hein w/ Brett Christensen - Stryper Expo 2001 (photo: Rich Gardner)

When did you first see/hear Stryper, and what was your first impression?

A producer, Jon St. James, who we were working with told me about a band called Roxx Regime. I got a tape and met with Robert Sweet. I loved the tape and heard a demo of “Loud and Clear. I was hooked and soon met with the band and saw them play at a private showcase.

When did you first learn Stryper were a Christian band?

I was not aware of it until I went down to listen to the masters with the band in their studio. I had taken an in-house producer with me named Ron Goudie. Sitting there with the band was the first time that I was able to clearly hear the lyrics and think about what they meant. At one point the underlying message became clear and we asked them. Robert said “Yes”, we said “Cool”, and the subject wasn’t raised again that day. They later explained the relevance to the name Roxx Regime as well as the yellow and black that was, well everywhere, and on everything. We spent maybe 5 minutes on all of this and then went back to talking about the music. I was far more focused on Michael’s signing, Oz’s guitar playing, Robert’s drumming, Tim’s stage presence, etc. It would be awhile before we realized that their faith would be in fact a major factor in their success.

Was the decision to keep Stryper as an artist once you discovered they were Christians difficult, and how long did it take to make the decision to keep Stryper?

No. It was a matter of personal faith and as I noted above I didn’t think it’d be an issue. No doubt many of our other acts had their own beliefs and the only thing notable about Stryper was that they were more open about it. At the very beginning it seemed like a subtle nuance to a label that was used to selling records on the basis of the music.

Enigma Records prided itself on letting its artists be the final decision makers about what they sang about, what their brand was, etc. This openness got us in trouble a few times but we were pretty strong in our belief that it wasn’t our place to editorialize our bands. With this conviction it would have been quite hypocritical for us to have then censored a band that was singing about Christianity especially when we had let acts come out with records that were, um, shall we say counter culture? Another factor that helped was that even before the first release came out, the band came and performed a showcase in our Torrance warehouse for our employees (boy I wish I had taped that!). Everyone met the guys and really liked them (both as musicians and as people). This helped get everyone at the company 100% behind the band whether or not they were fans of heavy metal.

Also, because Stryper was so up front about their beliefs they had a certain coolness that comes when someone is so strong and unbending on their convictions. We had bands like Slayer come through the offices and see all of our Stryper promo materials and they’d say they’d heard about the band, thought they were cool, etc. Oddly the only negatives we ever heard were from the more traditional Christian channels who thought that a true Christian band shouldn’t play heavy metal, shouldn’t play with non-Christian acts, etc., etc. Robert and Janice had prepared me for this and had armed me with a series of comebacks along the lines of “not just preaching to the choir”.

When Enigma were gearing up to release “The Yellow And Black Attack”, and you realized you had to sell a Christian band to the masses, did you ever think, “What have we got ourselves into?” And what were some of the initial responses that Enigma received from the release?

We really didn’t think about it that much until the mainstream media made it clear that they had little interest in writing about an independent metal band and even less interest in writing about a Christian band, however a Christian metal band was something they found fascinating. Fairly early in the release we were getting feature stories in major publications including the Los Angeles Times and all of a sudden everyone wanted to hear about the Bibles being thrown into the audience and other anecdotes. That early publicity was the catalyst for more and more press as the word spread and it just took off from there.

From the standpoint of someone behind Enigma Records, when was it that Stryper really started to take off?

Certain stores in Los Angeles were selling out from almost the first day. While this wasn’t true everywhere in the city, the big LA record chains were getting calls from their Orange County stores telling them to send as many copies as they could get their hands on. This fueled the word of mouth that this act was worth paying attention to. Stryper also had some very dedicated supporters walking into stores offering to buy every record in stock. It goes without saying that this simply doesn’t happen, so these stories would be passed on, fueling even further the word of mouth.

Did the bands success surpass your expectation?

Only by about 10,000%

What impact did MTV have on Stryper, end even more so, on Enigma Records?

It was a huge impact for Stryper because even though press and retail were happy to work with a Christian rock band, album radio was something else entirely. What was called “AOR” had no interest and no matter what we did and no matter how much money we spent, we struck out. Then MTV started giving “Calling on You”, and later “Free” a few plays and the Stryper fans kicked into gear. We had everyone in the label stop what they were doing every day at noon and call the request lines. The video success then allowed us to skip AOR radio and go right to CHR (aka top 40) and the band had a hit single. It’s funny but we had to do the same thing with Poison a few years later as album radio rejected a glam band but once MTV showcased them, CHR embraced it. It’s not surprising that album radio pretty much died of self-inflicted wounds having rejected Stryper, Poison and just about every other upcoming act so they could play 7 Billy Joel songs in a row.

I remember when I bought the “Soldiers Under Command” album, I opened it up, and to my surprise, it’s white! What was the reason for the different vinyl colors which continued with the re-release of “The Yellow And Black Attack”?

We were looking for an edge to add even more buzz to the release, so we did a limited edition colored vinyl release. It was a little more money but had the side benefit of requiring the pressing plan to use virgin vinyl, so they tended to sound a little better. Mostly however, it was so we could put a sticker on the cover saying “limited edition colored vinyl”.

Enigma Records was not a Christian label, however, the roster included fellow Christian artists such as Guardian, and Barren Cross. Were their signings attributed to the success of Stryper?

Their signings were absolutely tied to the success of Stryper. I think that is how Steve (from Barren Cross) found us and Guardian was introduced by one of the Stryper road crew members. That said, we still only signed 1% or less of the bands that came to us, Christian or not. I liked Steve from the first moment I met him and wanted to bet on him and his band mates. I loved Guardian’s tape though it changed a great deal between the time that I heard the demo and it came out, as they evolved their sound. The early tape was quite progressive (almost space rock) which I’m kind of a sucker for. Their sound matured, but perhaps one day for fun they’ll go back and do a retro song for me. Anyway, I liked it enough that I met David Bach (who I still talk to), Tony and the others. As with Steve, I realized these were guys that I wanted to back whatever they did. They were winners and I was sure in the end they would have a successful career.

The LA music scene was thriving inthe 80’s, and as an owner of a record label, how often did you receive demos? And from those demos, what would you estimate was the percentage that a contract followed?

We received so many unsolicited demos that it was unmanageable. Fairly quickly I learned that if a band didn’t have the savviness to figure out how to get tape into the label via an existing contact of ours then they probably didn’t have the savviness to get live gigs and accomplish what needed to be done to be a success. We were a business ,and needed the bands that we signed to actually sell albums, otherwise we’d be out of business. So it wasn’t just the music, you looked for bands that had the work ethic and smarts to succeed. The first test is getting a tape to us via something better than the U.S. Post. Stryper (then it was Roxx Regime) gave it to a producer (the same one who we had worked with on Berlin). Poison used someone we worked with on Motley Crue. I could go on and on, and there was always an in. Even with the introduction we were probably getting several hundred a month and signing a small fraction so it was far from a guarantee but at least it got heard and that’s how it starts. We also did a lot of outbound searching for bands; constantly looking who was building a buzz playing live and/or pressing their own records and taking them to college radio.

The only exception to a band being signed who just tossed a package in the mail that I can think of was the Smithereens, when someone recognized their name on a package that was in a pile with 500 other tapes.

I remember one evening I got a call from someone asking if I had listened to some tape that they sent me by an artist called Julie Brown. I had the package on my desk but hadn’t opened it. I lied and said I had, but didn’t think it was right for us. The guy thanked me for my time. I felt a little guilty, but justified it by thinking what are the odds it was something we would have wanted. About 6 weeks later, I’m listing to KROQ and I hear a catchy little song and the DJ says “that was Julie Brown…” and I thought “Uh, oh”. In the grand scheme of things it wasn’t like passing on the Beatles, but it was a good reminder for me that each package could be the one and we did the best we could to filter out the ones that might be worth something. I was more careful after that.

Looking back at Enigma Records, that was quite a diverse talent roster; from Agent Orange to Devo, to Laaz Rockit and Stryper. What were some of the high points of the company, and equally, some of the low points?

The roster diversity was in our DNA. We never wanted to be labeled as a particular style of music. We wanted to be free to sign any type of act that suited us. Because of that freedom we were able to market a Christian metal act. The highs and lows is always an easy question to answer. When sales exceed expectations, everything seems good. When they don’t, nothing seems good. That’s the entertainment business and it’s why it ages you so quickly. Every success is followed by higher expectations and at some point or another they won’t be met. It’s just they way it works. Very similar to the world of sports. A low ranked team can be ecstatic even making it to the playoffs but for a high-ranked team making it to the finals and then losing in game 7 is seen as an unmitigated disaster.

Have you ever thouugh of starting up Enigma Records again?

I think it’s a great time to be an artist and a terrible time to be a label. A few years ago my brother and I, and a few friends looked at the market for music on the Internet and created a company called “Enigma Digital”, and it included a Christian rock radio station called Acaza. We sold the company to Clear Channel Communications who ended up not wanting Acaza. We sold Acaza to a doctor who was running a Christian music company who turned out to be a liar and a crook. We just asked him to cover the costs we incurred getting it back from Clear Channel. It was a labor of love for us. The doctor’s company signed the contract, had us do many months work, and then stiffed us. It was a real wake up call that just because someone says that they are a Christian and runs an outwardly Christian business that they can’t be extremely unethical. It was really despicable. Of all of the years that I dealt with hard core punk bands, death metal bands, Wiccan bands, etc., no one ever was as deceitful as that doctor. Go figure. Last I saw the site was still up with a “watch for us to return” message. I don’t know who owns it anymore or whether they even know its history.

All that said, I think there are some real opportunities for creating value between independent acts and social networks and I’m looking to see if there is enough there to build a business. If there is I will almost certainly use the Enigma name in some fashion in whatever I do.

Have you heard anything from Stryper’s new studio album, “Murder by Pride”?

No, but I’d certainly like to!

What do you think Stryper needs to do in todays market?

Many of the Enigma bands from the 80’s are doing better today than ever before. Poison, who was on Enigma, is constantly going out on successful tours and Berlin just recorded a live show at the House of Blues. Stryper just has to be Stryper and they will do very, very well.

Do you have a favorite memory or just one that stands out as the most powerful movement of God during a Stryper show or after show meet and greet?

Once the band got popular, people would always ask me if it was a gimmick and what they were “really” like. First I would tell them that in the beginning, it was far from clear that being open on their faith would in fact help Stryper sell albums. So much for the marketing gimmick theory. I would tell them this story to illustrate how it was more than just selling albums. In 84 or so, I spent a few days on tour with the band during a swing from Reno to Sacramento to Fresno. The mini-LP was doing well but it was still early. At the end of one of the shows (Sacramento I think) a guy walks up to the band and introduces himself as a pastor who runs a home in the area for people who’ve lost their way. He handed the band a business card and said something like “in case you run into someone who needs us”. A few hours later it is about midnight as we walk into a McDonald’s to catch some dinner before driving to the next town. In there a guy walks up to the guys and asks for a handout. One of the band members (and I think Guido who worked closely with the band) took the guy aside and said something along the lines of “Dude, we’ll help you with food but we can help you much more if you give us a chance”. In the span of 10 minutes this guy opens up with his story. He had moved out to California for a job that didn’t materialize, his wife left him and he ran out of money. His hand got crushed in an accident and he didn’t have money for medical help so it was just bandaged up with cloth. In fact he had used his last money to buy some heroin and he planed to take it that night to escape from the hell he had found himself in. While I watched, and in the middle of a McDonalds, he pulled out this syringe and gave it to the guys to dispose. They then pull out the card the pastor had miraculously given them and called him. It’s midnight but he answers and he comes to pick up the guy and give him a place to start turning his life around. I saw this with my own eyes. This wasn’t about album sales, MTV or big hair. This was as real as it can get. I still get chills thinking about it.

Daryn Hinton & Wes Hein - Stryper Expo 2001 (photo: Rich Gardner)